Mills Black Cherry Payout Issue

[WoodrailFanatic]

Guys,

I need some guidance on what to look for on this problem.

I have acquired a dime Mills Black Cherry all original slot.

The machine works fine on my workbench but when I put it in the case it will not payout.

In this example I have hit on a single cherry. If I exert some pressure on the appropriate upper payout finger it does pay. The finger is properly positioned at the hole in the first disk so it is not hanging up there.

Your thoughts please on what could be causing this.

Thanks!

[memphisbigdave]

Your payout springs are too weak, I had the same problem on a Caille. Contact Thunderfive, on here or eBay, for new or stronger payout springs

[WoodrailFanatic]

bigdave,

Thanks for the reply and the suggestion.

So just to clarify.....on your Caille it worked fine out of the case but did not when it was in the case?

I don't think my springs are weak. I have another Mills Black Cherry (25 cent) and a Mills War Eagle (25 cent) both of which work fine in the case. The springs on those two feel exactly the same strength as the ones on the machine I am having trouble with.

Anybody out there with any theories on what could be causing the drag or whatever is inhibiting payouts from hapening when the mech is in the case?

[mazzeosa17]

ThirdGenAmusement is right to first check that the fourth and fifth click of the mechanism cycle are happening.

Some other things to check (as I had a similar problem you describe recently with a customer's machine) would be:
(1) make sure your slide springs are tight enough. When I pulled out that customer's machine with the same problem from its cabinet, the bottom Master Slide hadn't pulled back completely. So you'd have to tighten those particular slide springs.
(2) you can loosen the 4 bolts holding the payout slide cover, as it may be holding the slide stack in there too tightly.
(3) you can disable the (anti-cheat) slide stop lever, which can keep the bottom Master Slide from releasing backwards - sometimes that assembly malfunctions. You disable the spring on the assembly and even can wire the slide stop lever so it moves out of the way.
(4) If you check your slides, make sure one of them hasn't been broken and then welded back together. I had that with that customer's machine I reference above- the Master Slide was broken, then welded back together and didn't work properly, so I had to replace the Master Slide with a new one.
(5) you can also make sure the slides aren't in there too tightly on their four posts. You should be able to manually move them very slightly from left to right if they are in there correctly and not bound up.

[WoodrailFanatic]

mazzeosa17,

Thanks so much for replying to my post and offering the excellent advice.

1) I will check the springs to see if they are weak.

2) I can wiggle the stack of slides up and down a bit so I assume this means the payout slide cover is not restricting the slides but I will loosen them and see if it helps.

3) I looked at the anti-cheat lever from the bottom of the machine and it springs back as it should and seems to move very freely. So just to clarify....if I remove its spring I don't need to do anything else to disable it?

4) I do think it is time to remove the slides and check them out for any issues. That will be my next move. Getting ready to go on a trip so it will be 10 days or so before I can do that. Will report back what I find.

5) The slides can be wiggled very easily from side to side so I don't think the posts are constraining them.

I very much appreciate your help.

[mazzeosa17]

On my point number 3, just to make sure the anti-cheat lever doesn't move back, you can secure it with a thin piece of wire. They usually don't fail, but I've had a couple of machines where they did fail. See my attached photo where I did this to a customer's machine, where the lever kept failing.

The problem is probably weak slide springs, or the payout slide cover bolts are too tight - good luck working on your machine when you get back from your trip.

[WoodrailFanatic]

mazzeosa17,

First off that lever that you wired up has been removed from my Black Cherry.

Well I am so disappointed. I decided to carve some time out of my Sunday and tackle the payout slides to see if that would resolve the problem. Someone had oiled them so I got them all cleaned up. When I reinstalled them and was putting the spring for the master slide back on its post the it broke! When I fished it out of the machine it seemed to be way too strong in relation to the springs on the other slides.

So I will order a new spring from Berten.......meanwhile I twiddle my thumbs.....sigh!

[WoodrailFanatic]

Sorry for the delay in getting an update posted here. Several things contributed to that; was out of town for a week, busy with grandkids, busy with pinball stuff, had a spring break and had to order a replacement and I was getting some off Forum help from mazzeosa17.

I have finally reached a resolution. The problem was the Master payout slide had a spring installed that was waaaaay too strong. I discovered this when I removed the slides to see if they had been lubricated - they had and I cleaned them....didn't help. I didn't replace the Master spring at that point because the mech worked out of the case and I wanted to see if cleaning the slides fixed the problem. I was so over focused on this point that I kept searching for plausible explanations to explain why it didn't work in the case and that lead me astray.

Finally out of desperation I replaced the Master spring and that did the trick. The machine is functioning smoothly now in the case. The very strong spring was causing the Master slide not to be pushed far enough forward during windup for the Payout Slide Lock Lever to slide behind the Master Slide. This was essentially creating a timing problem....the Master slide was not being pushed forward quickly enough during windup for the Payout Slide Lock Lever to slide behind it. As to why this was only an issue when the mech was in the case I am not sure. Perhaps there was enough extra drag from the handle to slow things down just enough? Opinions on this would be welcomed.

Thanks to all who replied. A special thanks to mazzeosa17 for all the off Forum help.

We can mark this one as resolved!